After testing shuttle like ship, it appears to me that nav sphere is not coherent with plane like control, it should be more like Simple planes for these kind of craft, maybe tacking an option on command pod to make it rocket or spaceplane

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    99 swope

    @PhilipTarpley - several suggestions have been made to have separate translation bindings. E.g. https://www.simplerockets.com/Feedback/View/FU2988/Separate-RCS-translation-and-rotation-controls-on-controller-input-settings
    I think the translation axes are obvious ones, but sometimes I think users should be able to add arbitrary axes as they need. E.g. a robotic arm may have a local X,Y,Z to grapple satellites. (Doing the inverse kinectics might be better as a mod than a core feature).

    21 days ago
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    @swope Yeah, the nav sphere needs the capability to bank/pitch to change the heading instead of relying on yaw, for airplanes.

    Regarding the translation inputs, that would be a good idea...I'm not sure if there is a suggestion for that yet, but if not feel free to make one. I actually didn't even realize they didn't have their own bindable inputs until a couple weeks ago.

    21 days ago
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    99 swope

    @PhilipTarpley - will translation inputs be separated from angular rate inputs? (X,Y,Z independent of roll, pitch, yaw?)

    That's would help the VTOL fans. F-35Bs, Lunar Landers, and docking spacecraft...

    I guess throttle is sort of the positive half of X translation...

    +1 22 days ago
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    99 swope

    @PhilipTarpley - I'm excited to see the update. This sounds really good.

    +1 22 days ago
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    99 swope

    @PhilipTarpley - my biggest trouble with nav sphere and planes is that the nav sphere autopilot commands yaw to change heading, but airplanes need to bank to turn.

    Boats and two-track ground vehicles use "rudder turning" while airplanes and bicycles use bank-to-turn. I sincerely believe this insight is why the Wright Brothers (bike guys) succeeded where Pierpont Langley failed.

    +1 22 days ago
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    @swope @ShakzDar @SupremeDorian @deusalgor The nav-sphere needs to be reworked to truly work well with "planes", but it should work a bit more rationally in the next update (after 0.6.9.2). Part of the problem I believe was due to many aircraft having a misaligned command pod/chip which is used to determine overall craft orientation and nav-sphere alignment, and those issues should be resolved (see my comment here for more info)

    +2 22 days ago
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    99 swope

    @ShakzDar as it is, the manual controls are too frustrating for most players. So I think some basic things would improve fun: 1) manual trim -- because tapping S a thousand times to keep the nose up is boring af. 2) aileron-rudder interconnect -- so bank-to-turn vehicles have coordinated yaw. Unless you have a twist joystick or fancy rudder pedals on the floor, coordinating turns is going to be impossible. The original Wright Flyer had an ARI cable. Beyond that, I think an expensive digital flight control computer part that makes flying really easy would be a good trade for campaign mode. Either you pay for easy, or you earn your shuttle landings with skill. The scripting side would be useful for lots of things, but it's sort of a different topic.

    one month ago
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    324 ShakzDar

    @swope But you're talking about simulator or real piloting.

    Despite being more realistic than 99% of other space games, SimpleRockets et Planes are just fun game.
    And I don't know if there will still be fun just setting an AP, or at least for non programers

    one month ago
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    99 swope

    Specifically for flying like airplanes, I think a flight control computer (FCC) part could have default controller schemes for pitch, roll, yaw, and speed. A lot of fighter airplanes use pilot pitch stick input as a command for vertically "g" blended with angle of attack, and the blending changes with speed. 787 uses a C*u control law in pitch, and P-beta in lateral-directional axes. In the game, maybe rudimentary controllers would have aileron rudder interconnects (ARI), and advanced spaceplanes controllers would have energy management like what is planned for Dream Chaser, so it has the right kinetic energy when it arrives at the runway.

    one month ago
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    99 swope

    @ShakzDar - there's a separate autopilot / flight computer thread that I suggest different levels automation... From simple timer-based staging and delta-feedback like the early days of rockets all the way up to digital-fly-by-wire and programmable flight computers that would run user code in Blockly or Python. (Blockly for mobile users.) In a career mode, there's clearly a cost (and maybe tech tree) to high levels of flight control automation. Maybe players could share their controller design on GitHub.

    one month ago
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    324 ShakzDar

    @swope That's the best thing to do right now but adjusting slope with the navsphere looks like a lil bit autopilot lol.

    Hope that they will implement SimplePlanes mouse system

    one month ago
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    99 swope

    I've had some success with using the nav sphere for automatic control of glideslope, and using Q/E for roll and using the mouse to turn the heading on the nav sphere. It's a bit weird to try to coordinate the bank with the heading bug. Currently I'm flying spaceplanes with WSQE manually for maneuvers, then turn on the nav sphere for pitch trim and to hold the glideslope. I watch airspeed and make adjustments to glideslope with the mouse to find the right gamma to maintain airspeed.

    one month ago
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    @SupremeDorian @AndrewGarrison @deusalgor I just use WSAD

    +1 2 months ago
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    820 deusalgor

    @AndrewGarrison how about that:
    1) normal SSTO controls will be similar to SP controls.
    2) In translation mod it can be controlled like in modern SpaceSim games (nose of ship follows your cursor direction)
    3) When heading lock is activated your ship's heading follows your mouse cursor (it will be similar to WarThunder mouse with assistant control mode).

    +1 2 months ago
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    @AndrewGarrison Especially with the heading locked, where control surfaces just lock in place.

    +2 3 months ago
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    Good point, the nav sphere is not good for controlling airplanes.

    +6 3 months ago

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